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Denob
(@denob_1630950336)
Member Admin
Joined: 11 years ago
Posts: 2903
Topic starter  

Feel free to ask health related questions here.
One of our volunteer topic leaders will be happy to answer you.


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thecrownsown
(@thecrownsown)
Prominent Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 867
 

Hello all,

Happy to assist with questions re: Health and Nutrition, and more specifically fitness. If I don't have the answer on hand am happy to do some research into the matter and get back to you.

-Experienced and competitive in a variety of fitness activities including Triathlons, Fencing, outdoor wilderness hiking, Krav Maga. Have a firm understanding on how one can reach specific goals starting from any physical condition including weight loss, weight gain, increased stamina, overall fitness, strength conditioning, low impact exercises, exercise with injuries/disabilities, etc.
-Fundamentals of nutrition, but also have a great asset to draw information from...my wife teaches food and nutrition, biology, and chemistry. Can provide information on proper diet, nutritional requirements, foods/vitamins that don't store long, those that do, proper and balanced foods, etc.

https://www.internationalpreppersnetwork.net/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=7738


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

Good day everyone,

Glad to be here with thecrownsown to assist with health-related prepping questions. I'm happy to know that he will be there to answer questions on nutrition and fitness as this would not be my specialty (though I'm physically active and would say I eat 'well').

I have worked for several years as an EMT-A in Alberta, am a Medical First Responder instructor and have also taught combat first aid and Tactical Combat Casualty Care (TCCC) to Canadian Forces troops. This background should help me answer questions pertaining to first aid kits and supplies, basic day-to-day emergencies as well as some serious SHTF emergency care situations. I also have good amount of medical resources I can draw from for hard to answer questions.

Happy prepping!


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thecrownsown
(@thecrownsown)
Prominent Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 867
 

Helico,

I have a question and I'll build upto it. πŸ˜‰ So training in emergency, standard/adv. first aid. got it, its a prepper standard. Worked as an emerg. responder, lifeguard in my earlier years..no problem, great info. and experience. Keep cpr, first aid up to date. piece of cake....well stocked first aid kid, OTC pharmaceuticals easy enough and again a prepper standard...

Now...what happens if in a severe emergency, medical aid is not readily available...you have to wait hours...days...weeks...or longer...
1)Where can people like me, basically civilians in anything pat first aid....get training for something more advanced like sutures, setting bones, popping a shoulder back in place, etc. Is this even something that can be passed on to people not in the health field? But in a severe situation, what if we are faced with that? Its great that I can immobilize a limb, treat for shock, etc....but what good is that if we have to wait weeks after that to see someone that can actually promote healing? If we "are on our own" what can we do to prep for that? Sutures for cuts, fractures, dislocations come to mind, but there are probably other injuries that can occur. I don't think any of us expect to be able to do the work of a nurse, doctor, or any other health professional. Its simply not possible. But is it possible to learn some of the basics, and if so where? If I had a choice between waiting 6 weeks for a doctor to pop my shoulder back in, or having someone do it in lieu of that...it would probably mitigate the situation and better than nothing at all to have at it earlier..

2)With proper training, where can us "civilians" not privy to the medical professional get things like suture kits, fracture kits, etc.?

https://www.internationalpreppersnetwork.net/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=7738


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livingpower
(@livingpower)
Reputable Member
Joined: 8 years ago
Posts: 261
 

Now...what happens if in a severe emergency, medical aid is not readily available...you have to wait hours...days...weeks...or longer...
1)Where can people like me, basically civilians in anything pat first aid....get training for something more advanced like sutures, setting bones, popping a shoulder back in place, etc. Is this even something that can be passed on to people not in the health field? But in a severe situation, what if we are faced with that? Its great that I can immobilize a limb, treat for shock, etc....but what good is that if we have to wait weeks after that to see someone that can actually promote healing? If we "are on our own" what can we do to prep for that? Sutures for cuts, fractures, dislocations come to mind, but there are probably other injuries that can occur. I don't think any of us expect to be able to do the work of a nurse, doctor, or any other health professional. Its simply not possible. But is it possible to learn some of the basics, and if so where? If I had a choice between waiting 6 weeks for a doctor to pop my shoulder back in, or having someone do it in lieu of that...it would probably mitigate the situation and better than nothing at all to have at it earlier..

2)With proper training, where can us "civilians" not privy to the medical professional get things like suture kits, fracture kits, etc.?

DITTO! πŸ˜€


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

Interesting question. It is unfortunately not easy to get that training in Canada outside of the medical world. Those examples you gave, suturing and setting joints / fractures are deemed medical acts, to be performed by licenced medical practitioners. This is why there are important caveats about the Good Samaritan Act in first aid classes.

That doesn't mean there are no work arounds...

1) there are a few books that every Preppers should have in hard print (and read pre SHTF!), amongst those are Where There Are No Doctors and Where There Are No Dentists. These 2 books are designed for anyone relatively inclined for medicine but without formal training and geared toward the provision of care in remote countryside settings. They are a good source of information. You should also have a book on clinical examination for diseases, a disease encyclopedia (like Merck Manual) and a reference guide on pharmaceuticals (like the Canadian Compendium of Pharmaceuticals and Specialties). For the latter, what you can do is go to see your pharmacist in the new year and see if they would be willing to part with their 2013 edition when the next one comes in; they may be willing to just give it to you!

2) befriend a Dr, Nurse Practitioner or a Physician Assistant. They may be able to demonstrate a few techniques (hint : having a Dr on board with your preps is also a good way to secure a stash of prescription medicine)

3) advanced type wilderness first aid training could also offer some good tips as they are normally designed around the fact that 911 is not accessible. A cursory search on the internet came up with a few places in Canada such as http://ravenrescue.com/emergency-response/wildmed/wilderness-first-responder and http://www.cwmt.ca/content/view/19/32/

4) another interesting options I've found are online type courses. For example, when doing so e research for this answer, I've found a website that might be of interest to you. For $79.95 (shipping incl), you get online training, reference guide and a practice suture kit at http://www.theapprenticedoctor.com/student-training-kits/ . I cannot vouch for the quality of the training, but the price seems reasonable.

Sadly, getting that kind of training in Canada is as difficult as getting advanced shooting courses, the options are limited north of the 49th.

This is also the case for "advanced medical" supplies. BTW, unless you need to put in "internal" stitches (think surgeries) you can do just well with butterfly closures or Steri Strips, both of which you can find in pharmacies and don't need specialty tools or training. You can look online at Sands or Allied Medical, both in Canada for supplies. Their prices are decent (at first glance) and you avoid the border hassle. You may be asked for credentials if you order certain items however such as IVs or similar so this is something to consider. If you find a good deal and you're prepared to do some explaining with CBSA if needed, then ebay may also be a good source for supplies, or as you may know, many American prepper websites also have a medical section offering things like sutures, IVs, etc.

I wish I could have given you clear options, but I'm afraid this is the best I can offer at this time. I will keep doing some research and will post my findings if there is something worth mentioning.

Oh... Un officially, for most dislocations, the answer is "pull."


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

I think I should have really added YouTube and the internet as sources of info. Just as much as prepping, emergency medicine by lay people is a bit of an underground thing, thouh info is publicly available.

Usual caveat applies when getting info online: check the source and try to cross reference with other sources.


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

I've found an interesting "how to suture" guide : http://www.pssurvival.com/PS/Doctor/Stitches_Sutures_ETHICON_Wound_Closure_Manual_2004.pdf


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runswithscissors
(@runswithscissors)
Estimable Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 219
 

I keep seeing advice on what to store in med kits - bandages, and gloves, and ointments and certain drugs like Ibuprofen.

My question is about the storing of drugs. What does one do about storing a quantity of them, like Ibuprofen and Tylenhol and such, if they have an expiration date on them? One has to wonder if it's worth it to buy and store several $15 bottles of pills, if they won't be useful after a certain time. So what does one do about expiration dates?

Runs With Scissors


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

Runswithscissors,

Very valid question. There have been many articles written on recent research done on this very topic. It has been proven that most medicines are safe to use for years past their expiry date. The only exception usually noted is tetracycline. The reality is drugs don't turn harmful once they expire, they only lose potency. What that means is that if you normally take a 325 mg Tylenol for a headache, you may have to take 1 1/4 tablet 2 years after expiration, maybe 1 1/2 tablet 5 year after, etc. There are no calculations for expired medicine dosage, so this is just an example.

So there are no problems with storing some extra over the counter meds and do not fear expiry dates. Matter of factly, I have a large drawer full of Ibuprophen, Tylenol, diarrhea and vomiting meds, heartburn, cold medicine, multivitamins, etc. things to remember :

1) Dark, cool, dry storage will preserve drugs for longer (avoid storing them in bathrooms where you enjoy steam hot showers!!!!

2) Use FIFO principle based on expiry date and

3) for everyone, NEVER flush old drugs down the toilet!!!!!!! Bring them back to your pharmacist for proper disposal if needed.

Hope this helps. Cheers!


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MoraGuy
(@moraguy)
Eminent Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 33
 

This is just an idea but it sure would be nice if a trained professional who is a member of this forum would make a list if what people should have meds for a shtf emergency. Well all can take first aide training and we know what to put in a first aide kit but what about meds to have that are available to Canadians.


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The Canadian Giant
(@the-canadian-giant)
Trusted Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 82
 

The question of advanced medical training is a very interesting one. As I have worked in the outdoor leadership industry for the past 16+ years I have been required to maintain advanced level first aid, and sometime technical rescue skills as part of my professional existence. Having taken both wilderness medical training and more typical ambulance based training, I would strongly recommend that people consider a wilderness first aid course of 80 or more hours duration. These course will cover long term emergency care (30 minutes --> multiple days), whereas St John Ambulance training assumes that an ambulance is available in 15 and a hospital in 60 minutes.

During these courses we have always covered relocations using multiple techniques,postural realignments of bones, spinal injury elimination skills, etc.

As for sutures, in general, at the EMT level and lower we are not permitted to pierce the skin. Technically this means sliver removal or lancing a blister is out of the question, but practicality suggests that we become versed in skills that reduce potential future harm and increase immediate comfort. The reality is that butterflies are safer than sutures, particularly in the case of deep injuries. Without excellent cleaning skills and equipment, the risk of sealing infection into the tissue, far outweighs the benefits of performing sutures.

So my advice is take an advanced level course, but realize that without definitive care, we must accept that our limitations with skills and equipment will result in loss of life. Is it better to apply a hundred bandaids to fifty people, or blow all of our supplies keeping a major trauma victim alive for an extra couple days?

Wilderness Survival and Bushcraft courses in Alberta
www.MammutBushcraft.com


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thecrownsown
(@thecrownsown)
Prominent Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 867
 

This is just an idea but it sure would be nice if a trained professional who is a member of this forum would make a list if what people should have meds for a shtf emergency. Well all can take first aide training and we know what to put in a first aide kit but what about meds to have that are available to Canadians.

Hi Mora,

These lists do exist and are on this forum. If you do a search you'll find them, but I will go back and repost those lists for ya here no problem! πŸ™‚

https://www.internationalpreppersnetwork.net/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=7738


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MoraGuy
(@moraguy)
Eminent Member
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 33
 

Thank you! Sorry for not see that post.


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helicopilot
(@helicopilot)
Member Moderator
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1490
 

Hello Mora!

Thanks for the question. As TheCrownsOwn has said, such lists have already been made available. That said, instead of showing up at your local drugstore with an exhaustive list from your favorite preparedness forum, a simpler approach is to think of what meds could your family need and that you should keep at home in case your favorite Jean Coutu or ShoppersDrugmart is closed. Cough medicine, Tylenol/Advil, anti acid, Gravol, Immodium, etc. then look at what prescribed medicine you may use and see if you can find a substitute form (for example, if you take prescription medication for heartburn, you may want to stock up on Zantac and Tums). Remember that generally speaking the store brands work as well as the name brands and usually cost significantly less. Just take the time to compare active ingredients to make sure you get the same thing.

Happy stockpiling!


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